Starter competition gun for daughter...
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So my 13 yo daughter suddenly got interested in shooting and hunting. So just to make sure it's not a phase and I end up spending money on a gun she won't use (although I would), I am swapping out our red dot sight for a cheap scope on our 22lr gun and I will take her to the range to teach her the basics of shooting. She is already a good shot with the red dot on cans at around 25 yds or so.
But since she wants to go with me to the local match, I am looking ahead as to what gun I'd like to get for her (or me if it's a phase) and I have so far narrowed it down to a 6mm Creedmoor. I would also like to try the Ruger RPR, but they don't make it in 6CM, so I'd like to ask people here for suggestions on either a good starter gun or a build in that caliber. One option is that I get her a 6.5CM Ruger RPR and later when the barrel needs replacing we can rebarrel it in 6CM. I'd like to hear thoughts on that idea. Butdget would probably be around $2500 including a scope, which she so far likes my Burris XTR II. So fire away, all inputs welcome, I am open to considering all options and suggestions.
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Is there any chance you already have a rifle that can be put in a smaller stock to work for her? As you know $2500 is a tight budget...and already having a rifle that just needed to be adapted would help.
Also...IF I went with the RPR I would probably go with a 243 instead of 6.5 creed in your situation. There should not be much ballistic or recoil difference between the 243 and the 6mm creedmoor. In my opinion...If you are going with a RPR, then shoot it just like it is. If you are planning to upgrade it with custom barrels, handguards, stocks, etc then you are going to be spending enough money to have a higher quality rifle built.
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I wouldn't get her a 6CM unless you are going to commit to replacing that when necessary. A .243 will fall into the same category. You'll be looking at 1100-1300rnds tops before you will need to replace that barrel. If you're good with that, then a 6CM is great, as it'll have an easier time of being setup properly for a short action DBM.
Avoid the RPR. Get a howa in 6.5CM. They have that new one setup with a chassis system. Perfect. Scope selection is on point for your budget.
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@orkan Wow! 1100-1300 rounds is not much, I knew the round is a barrel burner, but I was thinking I could get more than that. That's a deal killer I think. Which Howa are you referring to? Just checked the Howa site and I don't even see the 6.5CM caliber available on any of the rifles they have listed.
Edit: never mind, I found it. That looks like a sweet setup and right around my budget. Thanx for the suggestion.
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@orkan Why do you recommend to avoid the RPR?
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If this is for his daughter why not go with some form of 6br. No recoil, decent barrel life, easy to tune, fun to shoot and a tack driver.
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@tpk936 said:
If this is for his daughter why not go with some form of 6br. No recoil, decent barrel life, easy to tune, fun to shoot and a tack driver.
His budget is why. Damn tough to find a 6BR that feeds right for $1500. If not impossible.
@ramirojpc said:
@orkan Why do you recommend to avoid the RPR?
Because they are junk. ... and no, I don't care what the internet says about it.
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Howa 6.5 CM in either an XLR or MDT chassis. Get the barreled action from Brownells for under $500.00 and either of those chassis and accessories for less than $1000.00.
Can adjust length of pull, butt pad cant and height as well as cheek weld .
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@mamalukino said:
Howa 6.5 CM in either an XLR or MDT chassis. Get the barreled action from Brownells for under $500.00 and either of those chassis and accessories for less than $1000.00.
Can adjust length of pull, butt pad cant and height as well as cheek weld .I was just looking into this one and with the barreled action from Brownells for $475 plus the MDT HS3, which I can probably get for about $450 or less, I'd be looking at a setup for less than $1K. I think this is probably the best solution within my budget. Thanx for the ideas and recommendations.
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@ramirojpc The HS3 needs a buttstock. The PRS Gen 3 looks pretty good but I like the MDT V4 skeleton that has all the adjustment, To me it is worth the $$ for the adjustable pad height and cant. You can tailor that to your daughter and lock it in place.
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I would not get the MDT chasis for Howa, they state that only their polymer magazine work in their chassis for Howa.
KRG and XLR do not say this.
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@orkan said:
@tpk936 said:
If this is for his daughter why not go with some form of 6br. No recoil, decent barrel life, easy to tune, fun to shoot and a tack driver.
His budget is why. Damn tough to find a 6BR that feeds right for $1500. If not impossible.
@ramirojpc said:
@orkan Why do you recommend to avoid the RPR?
Because they are junk. ... and no, I don't care what the internet says about it.
I do know of a guy that got his RPR to feed 6BR.
But I do argee on the point that their not worth the cost. Why buy a $1200 gun that most guys end up changing the barrel, handguard, bolt shourd, and other parts on. If the RPR was selling for $800 I could get behind it more. I just think their overpriced for what they are.
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@norcal_in_az said:
I do know of a guy that got his RPR to feed 6BR.
Even so, a rebarrel will still blow the budget way out of bounds. RPR isn't offered in 6BR.
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@rhyno That wouldn't be a game changer for me. The MDTs are reasonably priced and from all indications work very well.
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It is in my eyes.
MDT may very well have a good magazine, but if I'm going to spend the money I want compatibility with my other systems, and I want AI mags.
Plus the MDT mags are thick and restrict the OAL more then an AI mag.
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@rhyno said:
It is in my eyes.
MDT may very well have a good magazine, but if I'm going to spend the money I want compatibility with my other systems, and I want AI mags.
Plus the MDT mags are thick and restrict the OAL more then an AI mag.
I see your point and it is a definite consideration.
I suppose I was speaking with my particular circumstances in mind.
I have been looking at both the XLR and the HS3 for my Howa .223. I like both, however the HS3 buttstock tilts things in the MDT favor.
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Yup, everyone should do what is best for them.
The bolt stop will need to be modified on 223 versions as well. To just shorten it it sounds.
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@rhyno Yes, that holds true on the XLR also.
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Yup, but we're off topic now as that only pertains to 223.
Which depending on what competitions you're looking at wouldn't be bad, very low recoil.
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@mamalukino said:
@ramirojpc The HS3 needs a buttstock. The PRS Gen 3 looks pretty good but I like the MDT V4 skeleton that has all the adjustment, To me it is worth the $$ for the adjustable pad height and cant. You can tailor that to your daughter and lock it in place.
Yeah, the V4 looks sweet, but it's almost $300 and almost 2.5lbs. I got a Luth-AR MBA-3 for my HS3 and I really like it. It has all the adjustments of the PRS and the MDT Skeleton for $160 and it only weights 18 onces. Thanx for the suggestion though.
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@rhyno said:
It is in my eyes.
MDT may very well have a good magazine, but if I'm going to spend the money I want compatibility with my other systems, and I want AI mags.
Plus the MDT mags are thick and restrict the OAL more then an AI mag.
My buddy that puts together the match forgot his mags one time, he shoots a 6.5x47 Lapua on an XLR chassis and he used my MDT mags and they worked just fine on his XLR. I think the MDT polymer mags are AI compatible.
The only thing I don't like is that they can't hold more than 8 rounds. Well, let me rephrase that, they can hold 10 rounds, but the rounds are so tight in there that the mag bulges out and the rounds won't feed in the gun. I have to use them only as 8-round mags. I called MDT about that and their response was to use the metal mags. That sucks.
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This is what I have come up with so far, and it's just right under my budget before taxes and shipping. Might be a little more after taxes and shipping, but this is very doable early next year.
Barreld action Howa 1500 6.5 CM Heavy Barrel $475
Chasis MDT HS3 Howa 1500 SA $480
Magazine MDT 10-Rd Polimer Mag $40
Buttstock LUTH-AR MBA-3 $160
Pistol Grip Ergo Tactical Deluxe Pistol Grip $39.00
Buffer Tube DPMS Receiver Extension Buffer Tube (Mil-Spec) $35
End Plate DPMS Buffer Tube End Plate $4
Scope Burris XTR II 4-20X50 SCR-MIL $1,050
Rings Vortex 34mm Precision Picatinny-style rings $130.00
Picatinny rails MDT Picatinny rails $22.38
Sling Swivel (x3) Mako Push Button quick release sling swivel $36Total $2,471
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@ramirojpc said:
@rhyno said:
It is in my eyes.
MDT may very well have a good magazine, but if I'm going to spend the money I want compatibility with my other systems, and I want AI mags.
Plus the MDT mags are thick and restrict the OAL more then an AI mag.
My buddy that puts together the match forgot his mags one time, he shoots a 6.5x47 Lapua on an XLR chassis and he used my MDT mags and they worked just fine on his XLR. I think the MDT polymer mags are AI compatible.
The only thing I don't like is that they can't hold more than 8 rounds. Well, let me rephrase that, they can hold 10 rounds, but the rounds are so tight in there that the mag bulges out and the rounds won't feed in the gun. I have to use them only as 8-round mags. I called MDT about that and their response was to use the metal mags. That sucks.
Yes the MDT mags are AI pattern. yet MDT says only their mags work in their chassis for he Howa because it is flat bottomed.
So there has to be some difference.
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I would try Alpha mags as well as Accurate mags maybe can tweak to work.
Although not in MDT they work flawlessly in my PTG DBM in both Howas.
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Ok guys, I have a dilema I need help with. The .22lr gun I have to get my daughter started is a Marlin XT22 with a bull barrel, nice little gun, but the problem is that as far as I can tell, there are not long picatinny rails for that model. I can only find them for the Savages and the Ruger 10/22. The only ones I find for it are the ones I already have, which are the 2 piece rails and unfortunately the little UTG scope I got and the rings that it came with won't allow for the scope to be moved back or forth to adjust for her to get a good cheek weld with a good sight picture. The rings the scope came with are the 6-screw rings, which are wide, I could get the 2 screw rings, since it's only for a .22, but I don't think even that will provide much adjustment for her to use the gun well.
Short of getting rid of the Marlin and buying a different 22lr, is there anything you guys can suggest on how to fix this problem?
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Murphy precision might make a rail for you...but it will likely cost as much as the rifle.
Have you checked with EGW for a rail?
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I've seen people take an AR cantilever and mount the backwards.
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@dddoo7 said:
Have you checked with EGW for a rail?
I have, but didn't see any rails for that particular type of gun. I also checked the Marlin website and the rails they recommend are the ones I have on the gun already.
@rhyno said:
I've seen people take an AR cantilever and mount the backwards.
That's an idea, I might have to check that out. Thanx for the suggestion.
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Because of recent conversations on my 6.5CM dies thread and readjusting my thinking 3-4 times in the last day or so, and find out a solution for this, I think I am good to go. I had just listed this little Marlin for sale on Armslist and was going to get my daughter a CZ 455 to compete with. But that means an expense of about $300 after selling the Marlin. I found a rail and some rings which for about $80 will work on the Marlin. So I am taking down the listing for the Marlin.
And if my daughter decides to continue competing, I'll just have her compete with my Savage 12 LRP in 6.5CM. When it's time, I will replace the barrel with a threaded barrel so I can use this break and rebarrel it as needed until I can save up to get a custom rig based on Orkan's recommendations. I think this is the cheapest way I can get my daughter shooting and competing while saving all I can for the future purchase.
