NY church after Texas shooting: 'We are NOT a gun-free zone'
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A church in Central New York has responded to the Texas church shooting by inviting its members to bring their guns to services.
"We are not a gun-free zone," a sign outside the Lighthouse Mexico Church of God in Oswego County says. The church's official website also includes a scrolling message that says "We are NOT a 'Gun free zone'- we protect our people!"http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2017/11/central_ny_church_guns_texas_shooting.html
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I may or may not carry when I'm at church. Despite what the laws are. Concealed is concealed.
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TN laws allow carry in church. We are a group of about 50 people. I bet there is never less than half dozen handguns at any one time.
And crazy thing is...where I go to church the preacher carries a gun!
It is a shame that this is what our society has come to...but we are there nonetheless.
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It’s common for Synogouges to have armed guards. Which is probably why it’s rare to hear about incidents near them, despite some people’s feelings of Jews.
It only makes sense, I know I don’t carry often enough, but I’m working on it
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@dddoo7 we don't have our own property for our church. So it's held at what might be considered a gun free zone.
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A gun free zone is only gun free if there are no firearms within it. Signs mean nothing.
If a cop shows up, it's no longer a gun free zone. The same is true if a criminal shows up.
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@orkan Unfortunately, if you show up at a gun-free zone with a gun, you are the criminal.
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@flyinphill All a matter of perspective then, isn't it?
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@flyinphill said:
@orkan Unfortunately, if you show up at a gun-free zone with a gun, you are the criminal.
I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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@norcal_in_az I would rather live in a country that continued living up to its libertarian ideals and concepts of personal freedom. Then I wouldn't have to worry about the 12. But that is not today's reality.
For now I mostly avoid, whenever possible, any place that chooses to make me the criminal for exercising my right to protect myself from those seeking to do me or anyone around me harm.
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@norcal_in_az said:
I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.
Pretty easy to be cavalier and throw that saying around when you're not sitting in a fuckn jail cell. Police put innocent people in jail EVERY SINGLE DAY and they don't even give a second thought about it. You're talking about intentionally breaking the law, and with that kind of attitude, they'll put you away for as long as they can and whoever comes out of that fuckn jail won't be who went in.
Think about that for a moment.
Just the fact that you wrote that post could be evidence of premeditation. ... and if you think being INNOCENT has one fucking thing to do with whether or not the cops will try to destroy your life, you are nuts. They will try everything in their power to put you in jail. They won't even ask you any questions. Your guilt or innocence doesn't mean shit to them. Once they set to work on you, you better have HARD video evidence of your innocence or you're headed to a cell.
If you don't think that is exactly how it works, you're too naive to even have a discussion on the matter.
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I would agree with that, but it’s not always the cops.
It might be better to say, even if the cops are good you are not free, if you have an asshole DA, Judge, or a bad jury it doesn’t matter.
And I know quite a few asshole DAs and Judges.
I hope I never have to fire at anyone, I don’t want to deal with it, I’ve had nightmares over it.
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Painting with a broad brush there, Greg. I have mirrors in my house and I suspect most other police do too.
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@orkan I don't disagree with you. We live in a society now where your guilty until proven innocent. It's a moral battle every time I carry my gun. Do I chance it and go in here or do I not? Do I support a business that doesn't want guns in their business? Your kind of fucked either way in gun free zones. Do you chance it to carry a gun and protect your family, but if caught go to jail and loose your job and not be able to support your family. Or do you not carry and just roll the dice that you won't need your gun and hope nothing happens to your family. I have no grand ideas that because I have a pistol with 9 rounds I'm guaranteed to stop anyone with evil intentions. But I also don't jump on the highway with just hopes that I don't get a flat and no spare tire either.
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@ragnarnar said:
Painting with a broad brush there, Greg. I have mirrors in my house and I suspect most other police do too.
The "a few bad apples" argument what you're going with huh?
You think I have no experience to the contrary? When was the last time you saw me take a stand on something without first hand experience? You think the stories of criminals perpetrating crimes against people and then the police arresting the VICTIM is just something that happens in the movies? The criminal lies to the cops, the cop arrests you on FELONY charges without even ATTEMPTING to ask your side of it, no investigation... nothing... and the states attorney tries to prosecute you for it. Those sound like good cops to you? If its just a few "bad apples," why are stories like this SO common? Everyone is lying except for the cops?
Do you think the "a few bad apples" argument is ANY consolation at all to someone that has been the victim of bad cops?
You're a good cop that has NEVER abused your authority? Great. Too bad that MOST cops abuse their authority in some way, just like MOST PEOPLE abuse authority if they get any. It is only the truly exceptional among us that can achieve power and not abuse it.
So, what are we going to achieve here? Are you, being a cop, going to be able to have a logical discussion about abuse of power in law enforcement? If you are, this isn't the thread to do it and I'm not going to sit here and argue about the fact that I've personally been the victim of bad cops MULTIPLE times. If you'd like to discuss it, start a new thread.
