2017 Rimfire Challenge
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Print the target using the correct print settings to ensure accurate size. Print "actual size" and landscape orientation. Do not select "fit to page" or any other scaling options. The O.D. of the center ring should measure .5 inches.
You can shoot this target with whatever rimfire you like. You simply must disclose what you're shooting and what kind of support and firing position you are using. Target is designed for use at 50yds, so you must disclose if you are shooting at other distances.
The image at top middle describes how to score. Everything inside a ring gets all the points. Break the line, and you get the next rings points.
Shoot as many of these as you want, as often as you want. Lets see who among us has the rimfire thing figured out. ;)
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Today was is not a good day to be slinging 22lr. Horrific experience. My act should be easy to follow.
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Great, I'll print a bunch out and see how it goes.
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@orkan
Isn't that the Annie you were shooting? Were you shooting left handed?This is mine for today. Good conditions...just didn't shoot as well as I could have.
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Wind calmed down a bit in the dark. Tried again with much lower wind.
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@dddoo7 said:
@orkan
Isn't that the Annie you were shooting? Were you shooting left handed?This is one of my right hand annies. ;)
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Looks Ike #3 and #11 are 100 points.
You are being tough on yourself.
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@hypo said:
Looks Ike #3 and #11 are 100 points.
You are being tough on yourself.Well they were too close to call. I don't have a scoring magnifier and I've no one to prove anything to other than myself. :)
Cleaning a half inch dot drill is one thing. Hitting 1/2" dots isn't all too hard in the right conditions. Keeping the entire bullet INSIDE the 1/2" dot. That's a whole other matter. I'm sure Wayne will be along with one of his benchrest rigs before long and show us all what it's about.
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I've been looking for a target like this anyways so win win.
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Had some fliers that were 100% my fault.
Need to work on that.
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I took a stab at it last night about 9:30pm. Put a flood light on the target and away I went. I haven't spent much time shooting paper so it's a bit intimidating and I have a lot to work out. When I'm in a seat position, instead of keeping my feet flat, I tend to get up on my toes. This makes me a bit unstable. I need to remember not to rush a shot and to remember my breathing. I have a nasty habit of gripping the stock fairly firmly while I shoot and I'm not very consistent with my trigger pull. This causes me to pull the gun a lot. I'm focusing on having a light to no grip on the stock and working on a smooth, fluid trigger pull. And most importantly, I need to remember to just freaking relax. It's just paper after all, it's not going any where. I'm so used to shooting live or moving objects, you don't have much time in that situation, you rely on instinctual shooting and everything just comes together if you do it right. Paper shows you every mistake. I'm really excited to begin this next chapter of mastering my technique and having it show on paper!
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So I spent most of today lot testing 6 different lots of RWS R50... trying to find something this 54.18 MSR liked. Couple lots showed potential... but nothing I was going to run out and buy 10 cases of. I remembered I had a random case of Lapua Center X show up this last week. This stuff is even better than my last case of it! It shot better in the 54.18 MSR than anything else I've tried thus far.
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Not ten bricks, ten cases!
Hard core.
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Just a few empties there.
I really need to start putting money away to order a bunch of 22 ammo.
The brick of Center x I got what Monday is half gone.
Also is that really old r50? The stuff I had was golden.
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@rhyno said:
Also is that really old r50? The stuff I had was golden.
It's a special R50 75th anniversary edition. They call it "jubilee."
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Oh, neat. It has an interesting case to it.
RWS has my favorite box design feature, that little table that makes it so easy to open.
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I'm heading to Mesa in May to the Lupua service center to test some lots for my rifle and buy 6 cases.
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Wind was more difficult today. I dialed some and was still holding left side of the inner circle during gusts. With wind like we are having today I was excited not to drop below 50 pts on any circle...although I only had a few that were 100's.
BTW-- I also got the bright idea to just run these targets through the scanner. Much easier to see than taking a picture.
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I should have been shooting targets instead of sighters for the first five. I would have picked up 100 more points. The cold bore is in that sighter group. Still...1200 is my best...but still leaves room for improvement. I want to clear this thing at some point.
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Is there a prize for the first 1500....Maybe a brick of match grade 22 ammo. If we all put in a few dollars we could come up with something good. I just printed the targets but does not look like I will get to shoot for a couple weeks. Ups the fun value. Thoughts?
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Your prize if you do it, is that you did it. Prizes for online "contests" are stupid. Always a cheater or ten. If someone wants to cheat themselves here, be my guest. There will be no incentive to do so. Cleaning this target is difficult. Cleaning an ARA target is more difficult. If a guy can consistently do it, he'll be in a position to rule the smallbore competition world. It's a worthwhile goal... but I'll award no monetary gain for it here. People routinely cheat for nothing more than fake bragging rights. With money on the line, a ridiculous number cheat. Look at some of the rimfire "competitions" at snipershide. Those guys claim to be consistently laying down and shooting groups with 22's at 100yds that I struggle to stack up at 50yds. ... and if they could really do that, they would win every ARA match they attended... ever.
Suffice it to say, they don't.
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@orkan wow cheating never crossed my mind. I do not go on sniperhide and rarely go on sniper forum's anymore. What ever happened to honor and integrity. I may have to break out the Ula 22lr benchrest rifle snd see how it can do compared to 40x.
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@tpk936 said:
What ever happened to honor and integrity.
Nothing happened. It's always been this way. As long as there has been loyalty, there have been those disloyal. As long as there has been trust, there have been those violating that trust.
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Cheaters gonna cheat; it is their nature.
They always seem to find a way.
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I don't see the point of cheating, never have, never will.
I didn't really look at the old scores on the hide 6x5 to see what they were like, was just a bit curious on it.
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@rhyno said:
I didn't really look at the old scores on the hide
There were guys posting groups at 100yds, that could win FIFTY yard ARA matches, and claiming they could do it consistently. Keep in mind that Wayne has been South Dakota and Nebraska ARA state champion several times... and if he can't do that with his benchrest rifles consistently, someone laying down with a bipod absolutely isn't. I have no doubt there are some good shooters there in the rimfire section on the hide, with some nice hardware. Yet the bullshit meter is frequently pegged out off the scale over there too.
You guys have seen some good shooting of mine. You've also seen some terrible shooting. You don't see cherry picked representations. Over the years, you've seen them as they've happened. Those of you paying attention to such a thing, can get a pretty good idea of my REAL capabilities. Same is true of @dddoo7 and others completing the Gunhive daily challenge. You see how they are doing, in real time, as they walk the path. Look at their targets from nearly a year ago and compare them to targets they are posting recently and you'll see a marked improvement from all. REAL & HONEST. My uncompromising attitude about such things has cultivated a user base here that respects those things. Any people that remain are on board with it, and that has created a place we can share real information with one another. Excellent, isn't it? :)
Regarding the 5x6 competition there on snipershide; I have no doubt if I spent enough time shooting that target I'd top that leader board at some point. So would Wayne. We both have the skillset and the hardware to get it done if given enough attempts. Yet what does it prove? To who? It's silly really. Competitions such as ARA smallbore benchrest are truly representative of ones capabilities. You are shooting at the same time and in the same conditions as everyone else. Not like PRS where you go from stage to stage throughout an entire day while conditions favor some and hurt others. Not like the 5x6 where you just keep hanging and shooting targets until you get a good sheet. Rather TRUE competition on as level a playing field as you can get. I see merit in that. Not enough to compete myself, as benchrest really isn't my bag, but still merit. Being a state champion in a sport like ARA or something similar is truly special.
Having said that, I think any and all causes which spur people to get out and shoot are worthwhile causes. I used to live and die by conquering other shooters in competitions. I was unbeatable for a time. Now, helping other shooters become unbeatable is what I live for.
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My 40x is fully capable of groups in the teens...but it sure ain't every group in every condition...or even every time I pick up the gun in perfect conditions.
I believe that most people that claim that their rifle will do "x" consistently have done said thing once...or maybe even twice and they BELIEVE that their rifle will do it consistently....however they really don't shoot enough to know. The typical story of people on forums is that the vast majority of them really don't shoot enough to know how their equipment performs.
I have no doubt that I will clear that target one of these days. I also have no doubt that I could sit down today with a brick and a stack of targets and clear one. However the truly telling target is the first one of the day and in reality would be a target shot without sighters.
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Man did I open a can of worms. I doubt I could ever clear the original target of all 15. All it takes is a slight breeze and bam your done. The ammo also could throw off a shot. I have a benchrest 22 that I have not shot in a long time. I put a bipod pin on it because I hated digging out a rest but still have to load 1 at a time. I have learned that after putting one bullet in at a time I loose my patience. I have also found with the repeater that sometimes I rush and that is why I doubt I could clean all . Heck I have never done better then 14 of the dot drill but you have 20 chances and the misses are through out. I need to bring all 3 of my 22 to the range when I get a chance. 40x single shot, 40x repeater and a ULA action in a benchrest set up. I am curious to see which 22 I will have more success with.
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@tpk936 said:
All it takes is a slight breeze and bam your done.
That's why you see benchrest matches looking like the circus came to town. ... and remember, even with all those gizmo's down range, the number of 2500's shot in ARA is RIDICULOUSLY low.
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@orkan who sets all of that up ? Shooter or host site?
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Each shooter. Nearly impossible to be competitive in that sport without a whole bunch of wind gizmos. So you see... if these guys can't hold groups consistently .25" at 50yds... I don't see how some snipershide hero's are doing it at 100yds or even 50yds off bipods with no flags.
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A new specimen arrived today. I had to get one of my unertl's on it right away and see what it could do. This is a factory original with all matching serial numbers 40XB with the most beautiful exhibition grade stock I've ever seen on a CMP rifle. It has some potential in the accuracy department too!
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That is a nice looking stock.
I think maybe this bit of Center x isn't jiveing with my 40x. It does good but there seems to be some fliers.
#1 and #13 felt good, cross hairs were still on the center after impact but I missed.
I'll shoot itand order some more.
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Different lot numbers shoot differently in different rifles. Lot testing is really the only way to find out what yours likes.
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@orkan said:
A new specimen arrived today. I had to get one of my unertl's on it right away and see what it could do. This is a factory original with all matching serial numbers 40XB with the most beautiful exhibition grade stock I've ever seen on a CMP rifle. It has some potential in the accuracy department too!
Nice looking rifle Greg. If my new one look half that good and shoots close to that I will be happy. Wayne
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Wind was blowing alot today as you can see from my sighters...but I was bored and wanted something to do.
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I just spent 8 of these targets, 3 rifles, and about 5 boxes of ammo trying to shoot a decent score tonight. 30 degrees out, 3-12mph swirly 8:00 wind generated by the fucking cunt that is mother nature.
If the wind is not dead still, and it's not above 50 degrees, you may as well go try skinning a live cat instead of trying to clean one of these targets, because you're likely to have far better success than shooting 1/4" groups at 50yds with a 22lr. Attempting to clean one of these targets in sub-optimal conditions has the effect of making you want to never shoot 22lr again. Breaking 1000pts on these 15 bulls? ...not super hard. Scoring 1500 or even close in switchy swirly bullshit wind and cold temps? Not a man alive can do it regular. Well, unless you go to a certain website. There you'll find people that claim to be able to do it all day long.
Here's my low score, and my high score from tonights attempts. ... and suck my dick you shit ass garbage 22lr ammo that refuses to shoot when it's anything but 70 fucking degrees.
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Last night's attempt. The wind wasn't very nice but I got a few good ones :)
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Finally got to try this today. Temp around 37- 39, but the wind was blowing 10 to 20. needless to say it was a challenge.
The guns are a 40X and a ULA benchrest 22lr but I put a bipod on it,
Here are the results. Not sure if I did scoring correct so let me know. It was a tough day. Wind sneaks up quickly. Ammo used was GECO.
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Fun isn't it? Everyone thinks they have an accurate 22lr until they try these targets. ;)
It's scored worst edge, so if smear falls outside a line, those are the points you get.
Your first 40x target I score as such: 860
25
50
100
25
25
100
25 (maybe 10)
10
50
100
50
100
50
50
100Second 40x target: 975
100
25
100
50
100
25
100
50
25
25
100
50
100
25
100ULA benchrest target: 1050
50
100
100
100
50
100
50
50
50
50
50
50
100
50
100
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Oh yes indeedy. My 40x is back into shape positively. Britel and I laid down and ran a target each this evening. The wind was 7-11mph, but wasn't super switchy. Just a nice steady wind. The left sighter block had two go in one hole on the right, so I put one click in the S&B, and POA jumps way high and left, two in one hole there. I click back right one click, fire one into the previous group on the right... so I clicked the windage turret left one, then cranked the elevation down a few mils and crept back up to my adjustment. Next round was just low right. Following round was just high right of center on the right sighter block. Then I tore into the shots for record.
This isn't the first time I've had S&B scopes refuse to behave when making small adjustments. I would say this is one of their primary weaknesses as an optic. They are lucky Tangent Theta's don't parallax down to 25yds, or S&B's wouldn't even have a home on my rimfires. I see S&B recently reduced their pricing by a huge margin across their entire product line... so at least now their performance is somewhat in line with what they charge... but still, for a $3000+ scope to exhibit this behavior is just retarded.
Anyway, the R50 was on point tonight. I completed the shots for record in less than 45 seconds. I had a headache, so when I saw the rounds falling where expected, I just stepped on the gas. Those last two 50's probably could have been avoided. I felt my bipod leg slip a bit during bolt manipulation between shots 13 and 14. I should have reset NPA... but instead I muscled through it and the target tells the story of what happens then on shot #14. I reset a bit for the final shot, but the wind had tapered off a bit and I didn't reduce my hold enough.
Shot #7 was right on the edge of being counted 100, but the two judges I had with me ( @gash and @brittel) called it 100. I'll take their generosity tonight. ;) The rest of my 100's needed no magnification or imagination to score. Convincing hits indeed! After finishing the target I put a 7 shot group into the scoring box, and a 10 shot group into the intersection between the sighter boxes.
As evidenced by my profanity laden account of my previous attempt, rimfire shooting can be frustrating in the extreme. It can also be the most amazingly rewarding thing as evidenced by tonights performance. If I had cleaned my suppressor weeks ago, I would not have had such dismal performance, and in turn would not have been as frustrated with the cold weather performance of rimfire ammo. I like shooting. I don't like cleaning. Despite this, knowledge is power. Now after finally satisfying my requirements of "proof," I can finally say unequivocally that dirty suppressors can cause accuracy and precision issues both. This will help me avoid being frustrated to that degree in the future. Such is the nature of shooting and learning. Being frustrated, led me to take the time necessary to burrow into the problem completely and root out the core cause of it.
Growth of this nature is rarely glamorous. It is exciting however. Turning suspicion and theory into knowledge and using that knowledge to be wise. I get a remarkable amount of satisfaction from that. To lay down on the ground next to a great friend and send some lead together to cap off a productive day is one of the simple pleasures I most enjoy.
When I get a calm day, that rifle and I are going to clean this target.
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First time prone behind my 40x. Ammo was wolf match target. Orkan and I started shooting at the same time. When he said he stepped on the gas he wasnt joking! He was standing up before I had my first row shot.
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So @orkan are you going to redo the lot testing you just did the other day, or was that with a different rifle (now that I think about it that might have been an anschutz)
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No, that was with this rifle. I don't plan to re-do it. In my experience, the lots that shoot good in a rifle system will continue to shoot good even when other things change a bit. Good lots will typically out-perform bad lots on most rifles. I testing the good lot I found in this rifle on 3 other rifles and compared those results against the worst lot on those rifles as well, and the results were the same. Those that shot well in this rifle, shot better than the bad ones, regardless of rifle used.
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Is that shot in or out? Is it 100 points or 50?
My great uncle used to shoot rimfire competition. He is the one who I got the win 52 from. In with a bunch of his stuff I found these things...and didn't know what they were for until a few days ago.
These are called "scoring gauges" or "scoring plugs". They are for sticking in the hole and getting a magnified view of where the bullet hole lands.
This is the above shot with a scoring gauge in the hole...and with the gauge it is quite clearly "in". I removed the spring and flag from the gauge to make it easier to see.
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Yup! You see these floating around smallbore competitions quite regular. :) Most of the places like champions choice, champion shooters, killoughs have them.
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I forgot to mention that while they can work well... using the little buggers is an art form all on its own. ;)
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