Awesome video Greg, never thought about firing virgin cases without the ejector. Will use this method on my new DT.
Thanks for sharing your knowledge. I would love to see a video on controlling runout and neck tension!
I wonder if because I use WLR primers is why more powder charges are usually lower than most others I see.
I think so; I have a RL-15 load that shoots the same with a Remington Magnum primer or the WLR.
@straightshooter1 said in Weight Sort Bullets for LR?:
A few months back I did a little experiment when I found quite a few of my SMK's had a bearing surface length .030 - .033 longer than others. So I too 20 of those that measured .499 - .500 and loaded them along with 20 that measured .466 - .467 and used same amount of powder, same lot of brass and primers (also seated at same depth), etc to see if there might be any significant difference just due to difference in bearing surface length. I also weighed them all and found very little variance and not much of a difference in the over all bullet length either. Though there was some correlation between the bearing surface length and their over all length and the weight. . . but not much and certainly not near the difference I saw in the bearing surface length.
I measured each bullet after seating and they seated within +/- .001 of each other within the two groups. What surprised me was that the longer group was giving me a shorter base to ojive length and I made adjustment to be sure these measurements were within that same .001 variance.
As it turned out, the 20 longer bearing surface length rounds gave me an average MV of 35.5 fps more than the 20 shorter ones. And as you might expect, the POI's were different.
So, .030 - .033 difference in surface bearing length does make a significant difference. But I'm now not sure just where to draw the line. Like . . . does .011 difference have much affect??? In any case, I now measure the bearing surface lengths for all my bullets and group them in batches that fall within .003 of each other and I don't bother with over all bullet length or weight. I get very consistent seating measurements now and I believe this has helped me get my SD's down to single digits and lower my ES's some as well.
It was a interesting and fun experiment and convinced me that measuring and segregating by bearing surface length can be a critical step in precision loading.
Thanks for sharing your experience and data straightshooter1! That is very helpful.
Just got off the phone with a nice lady over at Whidden. She wants me to send it 4 fires cases as well as the dies that are causing issues. I mentioned to her that I would like a reamed die with a 6.5 match remear instead of single point. Her response was “Sorry, we don’t exchange items that way. If you want a full price on a custom I can help you with that”
I guess I send this off to see what they think...
It might be worth mentioning too, that ( I believe) Area419 changed the design of the funnel not long after the initial release to have integral handles on the rim, rather than two tapped holes and a single handle via a separate piece of aluminum (removed in your photo).
Not a big deal and would still appear to work great with the Prometheus, but just a little more grinding/milling required for those looking to buy a current model.
Got it figured out. My rifle really likes 65.6 gr H1000. 65.7 gr produces small groups at 100 but is just .3gr away from pressure signs starting.
I put 10 rounds into a small group using both winchester and Norma brass with the 65.6 gr charge of H1000.
65.5 gr is on the verge of jumping back to a scatter node, therefore I settled on 65.6gr.
I knocked the center of a 1/2" steel plate out at 420yds today. Both winchester and Norma brass performed and held the same elevation. Back to stacking bullets on steel.
Did some more fooling. Still nothing ultra scientific but I’m trying to figure out what the machine is looking at when it sorts cases.
According to AMP its measuring the mass in the neck and shoulder region but I’ve also learned it’s sensitive to trim length and even the dent from the ejector.
If I’m going to use this in any functional sense I think it would have to be just before loading, similar to when a bench rest shooter would.
More to follow.
Thought I would bump this since the rebate offer ends on Saturday. Purchases must be completed with a receipt dated by midnight on March 31.
I bought a set of scales from Cambridge (linked in above post) and they arrived today. I didn't get the trickler setup since I am not sure that is how I will go when I start to reload. But I have other uses (such as inventory at my business) for the scales, so I jumped on them at this price.
Also of note, apparently the rebate has been so successful that the 120i supply is running short. So Cambridge got A&D to give them scales with a larger capacities at a discount rate to fill demand. Right now at Cambridge you can get a 200i (200 gram capacity) for the same price as a 120i, and a 300i (300 gram) for $15 more. Extra capacity is probably not of much use to someone wanting it primarily for reloading, but others like me can certainly use it. I bought the 300i and I have $540 shipped in it, $385 shipped after the rebate. Normally the best price I could find anywhere is $665 shipped.
The Z1 is where the progressive powder burn is done. From what I understand that is basically during the "build" of pressure. The quickload manual lays this out, so I won't rehash too much.
It seems rather insignificant to me as I all but ignore it during testing. The 95% number at top is indicating when 95% of the powder has been burned. That number is far more valuable for many reasons.
I saw this thread and even though it's a year old I have something that might help. I use Wilson chamber type seat dies for several calibers, especially for seating light bullets that are hard to hold in a conventional die set up like RCBS. I just use the drill press. I have a cheap harbor freight arbor press but it's a pain so I put a bolt in the drill chuck and adjust the table up to where it feels good and press them in with the quill. I clamp a piece of plywood with a hole bored in it the size of the die base on the table centered of the chuck and get after it. I get a little flex in my press so I have to clamp a brace from the base to the table to stiffen it up but that's it. Not a speed demon but they sure go in straight. I use a Wilson trimmer also, good piece of equipment.
Having the decaping rod adjusted to far down causes this. It bottoms out on the bottom of the case and causes it to bend. With the amount of leverage a press gives you it's likely you never realized it bottomed out. I had a forester FL sizer do that to me. It couldn't get it to bump he shoulder back and wasn't paying attention as I adjusted the die further down I didn't adjust the decaping rod up. Never was able to get that forester die to bump the shoulder either
I'd love to have a promentheus but it's just not in the cards for me right now, with that said so far I'm very pleased with the auto trickler and plan to add the auto throw shortly. The big advantage I see in the promentheus over the auto trickler/throw set up is the reassurance that a balance beam scale brings. My satorious has never given me a single problem but it always in the back of my head that it could.
The sporter is not capable of mounting to a suppressor...so if you ever plan to shoot suppressed this will be an issue.
You know the differences in the control module.
I haven't seen a need to hook mine to an iPad so I had no reason to buy the Xfr.
Well I don't own a can and don't have plans to get one real soon so that shouldn't matter to much.
I was just thinking of hooking it to the XFR would make up for not having the better display. After all it's only $25.
I didn't measure with a caliper, but rather a micrometer. Also I'd like to point out that I don't consider myself an expert at neck turning.
I decide what to turn to based on two factors: The chamber dimension indicated by the reamer spec and the consistency of the brass. If I'm forced to turn because of a turn chamber spec, then I will use that as my guide as how to cut the necks. If I turn because I'm wanting more consistent seating pressure and what not, I'll just clean up about 80-90% of the neck with the intention of making them "round."
I'm hesitant to give an answer here because I haven't done the kind of accuracy testing required to ensure the correct answer. So instead I'll tell you what I do: I measure the primer pocket depth. I measure the primer thickness to the top of the anvil. I measure the primer cup thickness.
I make anvil contact with the bottom of the primer pocket, then I go an additional .002 to .004.
Sometimes this will put primers flush with the base. Other times it will have them recessed as much as .008. It really all just depends on the brass and the depth of the pockets. I can't say if that is the best or not, but I've clearly had acceptable results.
Is the 7-300 NM a step up from 7 LRM?
Yes. .585 bolt face vs .540 bolt face.
How about brass availability and cost?
About $2 each for both. It's easier to find 300NM brass than 7LRM.
I have been using the XHCG for about 3 years now and the only thing I wish for is a drop tube. This new set has it but does not justify getting a new setup. I might look at just the setup for 20 cal. The trays I do like and will get help on my anal retentive when I get an object under the case.
I'm close to giving up on the Peterson brass as well. I'm getting ready to resize after my second firing. If the neck concentricity is still all over the place with many greater than 0.003 in runout then I'm done. On a side note I have a Sinclair concentricity guage and it works very well. I can see the "wheels" in the two setups above being very handy and speeding up the process.
I didn't get the lathe with it. I have access to a "real" lathe, so I didn't need the drill-powered jobby they sell. Not that there is anything wrong with it... but a true tailstock setup is pretty awesome!
Completely agree. I did pressure testing all the way to 94.0 and never had anything but a slight ejector mark and no other visible signs but I stopped there. 92.0 was producing good groups at 100 and good numbers on the chrono, but I just felt that the accuracy should be sub .4 with my reloading ability, shooting ability and components.
So, I really took some time to work on my own fundamentals because these magnums will exploit every weakness within NPA. Then, I started load development all over. I'm pretty happy as I am sure you can tell. 😁
Another example of a piece of brass that I will cull. Nosler(norma) 17rem brass here. For some reason the case on the right exhibited odd markings after annealing. It was very clear that the markings were more than surface deep. I could speculate as to why those markings showed up, but that is all it would be; speculation. The point is that it was the only piece of brass that was different from the rest. All the others looked like the brass on the left. It is important to pay attention to little differences like this and understand that inconsistencies can come from any number of variables during manufacturing. All pieces are not created equal, and it is not uncommon for employees to pick up stray brass and throw them in the mix. These cases should be culled, or at the very least, separated. They can come in handy for random testing where brass will be sacrificed.
Here is another 17rem case I found with a creased shoulder/neck. This was the 2nd firing... so I missed this the first time through.
The hornady case feeder has an arm that screws to the bench top. Then a tube comes down from the hopper and is held by a bracket. I just set the bracket at the right height for the cases being used. It was really simple.